2006-138 Meeting Minutes
PDF-UA 2006-138
November 15, 2006
PDF/UA Working Group Teleconference
PDF/UA (Universal Accessibility) Working Group Draft Meeting Agenda
Wednesday, November 15, 2006, 3:00 P.M. - 5:00 P.M. EST
Conference Call Information
International Dial-in: +1-303-928-2600
U.S. Dial-in: 1-888-742-8686
Conference ID: 7083945
NOTE: The meeting will be conducted "live" on the Wiki.
Roll Call
Duff Johnson, Chair, Document Solutions - DJ
Joe Clark, Independent Accessibility Consultant - JC
Ferass Elreyes, Netcentric Technologies - FE
Betsy Fanning, AIIM - BF
Mark Gavin, Appligent - MG
Loretta Guarino-Reid, Adobe Systems - LGR
Greg Pisocky, Adobe Systems - GP
Leonard Rosenthol, Adobe Systems - LR
Neil Soiffer, Design Science - NS
Action Items indicated with an AI
Approval of PDF/UA 2006-137 Agenda
Approved
Guarino-Reid / Soiffer
Approval of pdfua-2006-11-01-minutes
Approved
Rosenthol / Soiffer
Announcements, harangue from the Chair re Committee participation
Loretta Guarino-Reid is leaving Adobe to work on accessibility for Google. She is also resigning from her position at PDF/UA. Duff Johnson has asked her to consider continued participation with PDF/UA if appropriate to her new duties at Google. On behalf of the work group, Duff expressed his thanks for Loretta's service to the PDF/UA work group and
Joe Clark has launched his accessibility research project. Visit http://joeclark.org/micro/ for standards in captioning, audio descriptions, sub titleing and dubbing.
Discuss new PDF/UA 1.0 DRAFT, Committee to suggest changes/corrections
Since previous meeting. The structure of the Wiki has been reorganized in accordance with the new framework. Individual pages have been created for the concepts at hand. Uses the editme.com include feature. The entire language of the draft can be viewed as a single page.
NS: The reworking of the Wiki is a good general approach.
DJ: Now is a good moment to express opinions on how this has been done and approach. The title of each page is a link to the page. Barring any objections, the Chair assumes approval for the reorganized draft.
Discuss work performed on the Module: Text since the last meeting
DJ: More work has been done since the last meeting than we can cover. Let's discuss the Text Module.
LGR: What I did was go through the relevant sections of the tagged PDF section and put them into the relevant language of what should be required of our standard.
DJ: Your method was to comb section 10.7 looking for the appropriate statements and then assembled the appropriate concrete language (shall, must, etc.) and appllied it appropriately.
LGR: Reference to section 10.8.1 required with a note that points back to 3.8.1
AI: Joe Clark send email to Michael Kaplan regarding Unicode encoding. Discussion will be moved to another page and clean up to occur on the entry.
LGR: Reading order goes all the way to the character level.
LR: What is logical order?
DJ: It's what the human would interpret but a mechanism has to be available to enable the machine to relay it accordance with how a human would interpret logical order.
JC: Would writing mode be applicable? (pg. 848)
JC: With the concept called reading order and with writing mode we may have solved the problem.
LGR: I take back my comment that there is nothing in here that would allow us to specify direction.
DJ: I would like to propose that Joe replace with content referring to this section and suggest your specific addition. You would be the right person to put in the appropriate shall statement.
JC: I will put in all the possibilities.
LGR: It's not the screen readers that will use this, it will be reflow.
JC: I will do that and move the discussion portion on to another page.
NS: A number of you know TeX the conversion that TeX makes is that it does not tag the document. It produces content based on the font.
NS: Perhaps the information I have provided is more appropriate as an appendix. I do not believe the PDF reference has attributes which in certain situations perform in one fashion but in other situations behave differently.
LGR: I don't believe it should be an issue.
NS: Can you have different owners for the same attribute?
LGR: That's the whole reason for having attributes?
[Momentary pause as we were disconnected]
NS: I will rewrite the explanations to say what belongs to the tag and what is required and what is optional. Should I point to the MathML spec - links?
MG: It's preferred that refer to the formal spec instead of rewriting part of it.
MG: General comment, PDF in general tends to reuse names a lot with different meanings. In dictionaries they tend to be reused a lot in order to save space.
DJ: Provided a recap of our progress to date for our late arrivals. With everyone's permission I believe we can conclude our discussion of MathML today. Neil knows what remains to be done on this topic and is well on his way.
Discuss work performed on other modules since the last meeting... IF ANY
DJ: We can talk through the draft in terms of going through these pages. For example beyond the MathML section we can go into Graphic Objects. Dick Herring did some work on mulitmedia objects.
LGR: Is there a reason to limit these formats to those listed in Appendix H ?
LR: I can say the PDF/E committee has adopted that requirement that only those listed in Appendix H are supported.
JC: Flash?
LR: swf the original Flash is supported. Flash video, flv is not at this time.
JC: Looking in Appendix H could someone tell me which subsection I should me looking at?
LGR: 10.28
LR: I can verify that PDF 1.5 supports avi
MG: Windows media is avi that's the one that is supported according to the table.
LGR: The table does mention these are the ones to use for cross platform PDF files.
LR: If that's the case then that's why Windows media is not listed.
NS: Is there an accessibility problem that would cause us to limit the media types.
LR: Are we concerned with the accessibility of the embedded content or how the PDF will describe the accessibility of the embedded object.
FE: I think we can take some leads from HTML. If multimedia the content should be synchronized, if you have video there should be closed captioning. Why limit the formats, we should specify requirements.
JC: And then we also have to distinguish between embedded and referenced multimedia.
NS: Good point, we need a bullet point to distinguish between the 2.
JC: If you embed it you own it and its your baby. If you reference then/
MG: You can have externally linked multimedia that are external to the PDF file. You could also do that with an image but almost nobody does. It's really only used by the prepress folks who go from low resolution to high resolution. I can look it up and tell people how to do it. Nothing in Acrobat wil do it for you. I would have to look it up myself.
DJ: What do we feel about this multimedia page?
LGR: The one comment I have is he appears to combine both media and multimedia and I feel uncomfortable about that.
Update Action Items, review ASSIGNMENTS. More haranguing from the Chair
DJ: Action Items page has been rearranged. All previous action items have been dumped into an action items archive.
MG: I looked up alternate images and that is what it is called.
LR: They are forbidden by PDF/A /X and /E
LGR: The truth is you can put alternate text on any structure element.
Duff Johnson updated the action items from the Action Items page.
LR: I have a multimedia collection that I am working on making reasonably available given the large size (upwards of 20 - 30 mbytes per example).
DJ: Tables would be a subject that is worth special attention the next meeting. Tables module assigned to Ferass and to Neil. LGR, NS, and FE will get together on the phone to discuss tables this Friday.
Wrapup
PDF/UA wishes Loretta well and thanks her for her participation and contributions. We wish her well and hope to hear from her again soon.
FE: Target date 1st of December?
DJ:
Adjourn
Move to adjourn
Gavin / Soiffer
Meeting adjourned at 5:01, next meeting to take place November 29, 2006 3:00 to 5:00 pm eastern time.
